The second hand market

[Papalazarou]

Just looking through AT today and was interested to see the prices of sports cars 'like' the NSX.

Obviously this is a debate in itself, but for arguments sake I chose;

Porsche 993,996 and Boxster.
Ferrari 348,355


Anyway, it made me wonder whether the 911 is a modern investment when there are 509 to choose from on AT and that's between £22.5 and £35K? You'd think that the sheers availability would drive the price down considerably, but still they 'appear' to hold their value well after a certain point.

However, whilst the early 996's suffer a bit the 993 still seems to fetch pretty good money; £38K good for the right car or so they're advertised.

Boxsters, all 1438 of them also fair quite well (if they're selling) considering there are so many, but there seem to be a glut of 986's and 987's don't seem that bouyant.
Ferrari 348's are quite scarce, around 14 for sale on AT, in contrast to 65 355's. Interestingly, the 355's now start at £34K whilst an early 348 can be had for £22.5K.

At the moment there are 7 NSX's on AT. The normal mix of autos, imports and mid 90's coupes.

It made me think that although the NSX is obviously much rarer than the cars above, one of the reasons it appeals less to some buyers is because there are so few variants (bar Japan) compared say porsche where there are many different wheel choices, trim levels and colours.
Don't get me wrong I really like the NSX but there's never been much choice. I think that people enjoy trying to find the right car and that's hard to do when there are only 7!
furthermore, I've never seen an NSX for sale that looked that good in the photo. When I looked for one originally, I really couldn't get my head around the proportions (no jokes please).

One more comment; you always hear road testers and forum junkies siting 'a dated interior' for not choosing an NSX. Why do we never hear that about Porsches of the same era? I really like the look of the 993, but inside it looks like a Healey/Mk1 escort cross....with a Passat steering wheel.


Cheers, discuss, rip me apart if you can find an argumant in there somewhere??!!#;-)

[AR]

I love the NSX, it's lines look better with the pop ups than the revised look IMHO.

But look at this:

http://www.channel4.com/4car/gl/gallery/gallery/511/

Just one of many of the classic lines.


Cheers,

Ary

[Papalazarou]

I've seen those before. The Bizzarini is an awesome looking car.



Cheers,


James.

[AR]

I never seen one in the metal, but there is something about old cars that goes beyond 0-60 numbers. The NSX is approaching that status.

[Steveycaz]

Interior's a bit dated!

[britlude]

I've seen 2, a road going one regularly parked in the pre-66 public carpark at Goodwood revival, and a race one was a regular, until it was written off racing on the sunday race last september.....

before....(or more accurately 'during')


after.. bow your heads, show some respect....



they had to chop the roof off to extract the driver (Martin Stretton) who broke his elbow wiping out an estimated £2.5M car!!!! by the way, it was the first one made, the original!!!! oops!


anyway back to the original topic...... why are NSX's not so 'popular', although rarer....??? it hasn't got a porsche or ferrari badge on the front, it's as simple as that! there's a certain snob value involved, making a practical, comfortable, useable sportscar/supercar that doesn't break down every 5 minutes ( that's if it even started in the first place) just isn't good enough!

as for 'dated' interior, i prefer 'classic', 'functional', 'as it should be', it's not dated!!!

[TheSebringOne]

Talking about beautiful, classic & timeless body lines, heres one of my fave cars!

http://www.seriouswheels.com/1970-19...-SV-Red-SA.htm

Another!

http://www.lamborghiniregistry.com/M...raSV/4870.html

[Senninha]

James,

SO this is what you were doing instead of hooning around with the rest of us yesterday

Ok, I've read your first post a couple of times and what appears to jump of the page for me are two things, pricing and volume.

On the pricing it is clear to see that the advertised prices for the models in question from both Porcshe and ferrari are steadily dropping. However, because a large number of these cars will be dealer advertised, this is inflating the prices that they are actually selling for.

Compare this to NSX pricing over the last 18 months. Clean early cars are still marketing and selling for high teens, occasionally breaking the £20k. The later facelift cars have been steady around the high 30's to mid 40's. The 3.2 pop-ups are still a rarely advertised car but generally sell quickly if the right condition/color/history.

Onto the volume and as Jon says, its largely a badge thing. Many aspirational owners of sportscars/supercars are only looking to own a F or P badged car. IMO (and the bit I probably get flamed for) the majority are not true driving enthusiasts but simply buying because their finances allow them too.

Back to the NSX and in my experience, people are buying the car having been a keen 'driving' enthusiast for many years or have come through the ranks of Honda's sporting / R variants.

In some ways the motoring press have done us a favour. By complaining that the NSX is too easy to drive, too reliable, too practicable and etc, they have turned the hairdressers and merchant bankers from our doors and sent them to the high cost ownership of the other marques. This in turn resulted in the lower sales volumes, <500 into the UK I think. Deduct those cars lost in accidents, poorly maintained or converted to track day weapons and there are probably less than 400 straight NSX left on the roads.

As for choice, well thats an easy one to finish on. If its from Italy then it should be red with cream leather. If german then it depends on the model. 993/6's always work well in the darker colors whereas the cockster seems to look more palatable in lighter colors. Scan the classified's and you will see pricing trends follow these unwritten rules.

So to the NSX and its limited choice. Lets be honest, there isn't a bad color combination in the UK (except blue leather IMHO), so the color choice is easy. Decide what you cannot live with, then accept all others. Do you want PAS? No, look for early cars, yes then 95's onwards. Auto vs manual. If its a daily then grab a bargain auto otherwise you're looking for a manual. Probably the hardest 'option' to find these days appears to be the T-top. I'd guess the only other option is around the history of the car. With so many 'new' NSX coming out from hiding over the past 2 years, its likely that someone somewhere knows the history of a car. Add this knowledge to any history the NSX is supplied with and the last option you have is to buy or not to buy........

I seem to have got a bit involved in this one so time to sign off .... long may the debate and NSX ownership continue....

regards, Paul

[markdas]

I guess the starting price on launch was seen as very high for a Honda but in comparisson to the cars it was pitched against in ability and styling it was a cheap option at the time.

The Honda badge for 65K is always mentioned too I think, as is the dated interior! When the idiots like Needel slate a Ferrari for something stupid....the sheer power of the Ferrari history makes people ignore it....with a Honda I imagine people tend to only see this as a failing and a shortfall in Honda attempt to beat the competition....in actual fact they must have achieved handling, reliability and useablilty in the NSX that was just not appreciated until many years later.

When I first started thinking about an NSX (my wife actually found the article in one of our many books) and I instantly thought that they must be highly strung, tempermental, old experimental cars that never caught on.......it takes actually talking to owners and listening to real life experiences to realise just how revolutionary and successful they are....Dont you think that maybe they have reached their bottom end prices and may well increase even if or when a new one comes out? The NA1/NA2 will always have that little bit more history in terms of the Honda F1 team at the time, Sennas input and testing and the fact that Honda sucessfully took on Ferrari and Porchse and achieved their aim?

Probably get more people buying NSX''s to use rather than store.....I even think its safer to leave the NSX in a car park at Tescos than it is our Audi Allroad! People seem to admire and wonder what the hell it is rather than have this envy or distaste at a Ferrari or Lambo badge.

Just my thoughts
Mark

[simonprelude]

Hopefully a good NSX will never fall below £10k, if it does then there's something seriously wrong with the economy, or taxes have made running one of these only for the people who can afford Ferrari / Porsche running costs.