Platinum Member
I don't have that part on my car.
Platinum Member
Friction disc balance marking
Unlike 02+ NSX-R, the engine is not balanced with the specific crank shaft/crank pulley/TB drive pulley/flywheel/mid/pressure plates combination so the balance marking on the disc is to distribute the inertia evenly.
Although the crank shaft may look rotating at the steady angular speed at a certain steady rpm, it’s continuously accelerating/decelerating against the time due to the nature of the ancient 4 cycle engine theory.
Addition to acting as the damper when sharp changes in acceleration rate, one of the feature of the torsion spring on the friction discs is to reduce the gear backlash rattling noise from the gearbox when in neutral or under acceleration or steady speed cruising.
So, spreading the inertia evenly will help reducing the potential changes in angular speed.
Thus, you want to set the balance marking on 1st and 2nd friction discs with 180deg offset.
It’s bit too late but when I install the new flywheel, I prefer setting the eng at #1 TDC and set the flywheel triangle marker towards the centre of the rear bank when looked from the gbox side.
This is the method used when doing NSX-R CL service and if you are reusing the flywheel on NSX-R, you must put it back at exactly the same position on the crank end.
Eng/Gbox mounts
From the post on NSX Prime, you already found the answer but in case someone searches this thread in the future, going to post it here. May need removing it for copyright reason.
All photos courtesy of NSX Wiki on NSX Prime.
Greasing
I now understand the timing you took the photo in post #42.
I normally pack the groove of release bearing with Urea grease and nothing else on remaining area.
Then, I touch the surface of bearing guide with my finger to leave really thin grease film but nothing visible.
I don’t test fit the release bearing once the groove is packed with the grease.
I prefer test fitting the friction discs on the main shaft at different angle, like 10 different alignment.
You don’t need to go through every single spline teeth but this will ensure that you won’t struggle inserting the main shaft when mounting the gbox into the CL set.
For the spline of the discs, not too much grease please but cover every single teeth all the way.
Bit too late but please pay extra attention on greasing the release fork saddle and where the fork meets the release bearing.
Initialisation
Not sure how the CL set was delivered to you but if you pressed on the mid plate before installation to check the guide movement, you should be fine but if not, you may have left tiny gap between the edge of guide and back of the mid plate if you only finger tighten the bolt until it hits the guide and used it as the starting point before further tightening it 180deg.
You probably have enough margin even with the above method but you want to tighten the bolt until the guide touches the back of mid plate and that’s where the starting point before tightening it further.
By the way, from other photo, you’ve done all these with front cross member ( the big grey metal bracket where the front mount centre bolt sits) in place?
Hats off to you if that was the case.
I don't follow the Workshop manual and use different method with cross member out of the way.
Kaz
Platinum Member
Thanks for your explanation, Kaz.
I'm a technically very curious person and wonder what happens if...that's why I played with the release bearing wondering where the grease goes to when you put it on the guide, esp. when you put on too much. The least thing you want to have is grease on the clutch discs regardless where it comes from. BTW on the input shaft I've distributed the grease with a very soft toothbrush all away round. Same procedure for the splines in the clutch discs. Testfitting and remove all overgrease completely.
the gearbox is now on the car hanging with the engine on all four mounts. The center screws of the four mounts still have to be torqued down in sequence. I've fitted the slave cylinder and shifting cables and sat in the car to check the shifting. Looks fine.
Yes, with the front cross member in place. It's tight in there. A welcome challange for a Swiss precision workmans craft. Thanks to the lift of Asylum you can fully concentrate putting the gearbox on the engine. With a conventional gearbox lift you might have to use 90 % of your force to hold the gearbox and have just 10 % to concentrate on where it has to go. With Asylum's lift it's the other way round.
I have some easier things to complete on the car now. Should be finished over the weekend. Can't wait to start it up the first time.
I was asked why I opened a thread here in the UK forum. Well, while the US forum was my primary source until some years ago there are much more and valuable DIYers in here. Very big thanks to all who helped!
One last question: the SM says to change the set ring on the axle ends before putting the axles in the gearbox. What is the reason behind it? The set ring doesn't look like it needs replacement. And according to the force I had to use to separate the axles from the gearbox I can't think of them going bad.
Because they do not know English, if someone could I draw it by hand this " I prefer setting the eng at #1 TDC and set the flywheel triangle marker towards the centre of the rear bank when looked from the gbox side."Originally Posted by Kaz-kzukNA1
Friction disc balance marking
Unlike 02+ NSX-R, the engine is not balanced with the specific crank shaft/crank pulley/TB drive pulley/flywheel/mid/pressure plates combination so the balance marking on the disc is to distribute the inertia evenly.
Although the crank shaft may look rotating at the steady angular speed at a certain steady rpm, it’s continuously accelerating/decelerating against the time due to the nature of the ancient 4 cycle engine theory.
Addition to acting as the damper when sharp changes in acceleration rate, one of the feature of the torsion spring on the friction discs is to reduce the gear backlash rattling noise from the gearbox when in neutral or under acceleration or steady speed cruising.
So, spreading the inertia evenly will help reducing the potential changes in angular speed.
Thus, you want to set the balance marking on 1st and 2nd friction discs with 180deg offset.
It’s bit too late but when I install the new flywheel, I prefer setting the eng at #1 TDC and set the flywheel triangle marker towards the centre of the rear bank when looked from the gbox side.
This is the method used when doing NSX-R CL service and if you are reusing the flywheel on NSX-R, you must put it back at exactly the same position on the crank end.
Eng/Gbox mounts
From the post on NSX Prime, you already found the answer but in case someone searches this thread in the future, going to post it here. May need removing it for copyright reason.
All photos courtesy of NSX Wiki on NSX Prime.
Greasing
I now understand the timing you took the photo in post #42.
I normally pack the groove of release bearing with Urea grease and nothing else on remaining area.
Then, I touch the surface of bearing guide with my finger to leave really thin grease film but nothing visible.
I don’t test fit the release bearing once the groove is packed with the grease.
I prefer test fitting the friction discs on the main shaft at different angle, like 10 different alignment.
You don’t need to go through every single spline teeth but this will ensure that you won’t struggle inserting the main shaft when mounting the gbox into the CL set.
For the spline of the discs, not too much grease please but cover every single teeth all the way.
Bit too late but please pay extra attention on greasing the release fork saddle and where the fork meets the release bearing.
Initialisation
Not sure how the CL set was delivered to you but if you pressed on the mid plate before installation to check the guide movement, you should be fine but if not, you may have left tiny gap between the edge of guide and back of the mid plate if you only finger tighten the bolt until it hits the guide and used it as the starting point before further tightening it 180deg.
You probably have enough margin even with the above method but you want to tighten the bolt until the guide touches the back of mid plate and that’s where the starting point before tightening it further.
By the way, from other photo, you’ve done all these with front cross member ( the big grey metal bracket where the front mount centre bolt sits) in place?
Hats off to you if that was the case.
I don't follow the Workshop manual and use different method with cross member out of the way.
Kaz
Platinum Member
Kaz means this:
The triangle on the flywheel (tri) is facing towards the middle of the rear head (c of rh) WHILE the engine is at #1 TDC (first cylinder).
If my engine was at #TDC (don't know if it was, I guess no) I should have turned the flywheel by 45 degrees clockwise and put the screws in at that position. I was contentrating more at the flywheel run-out but didn't wanted to dissertation about it...
Last edited by goldnsx; 02-03-2017 at 09:09 PM.
Hi,
Thank Thomas for help in clarifying. I really appreciate the technical aspects.Like this:
"the balance marking on the disc is to distribute the inertia evenly.
Although the crank shaft may look rotating at the steady angular speed at a certain steady rpm, it’s continuously accelerating/decelerating against the time due to the nature of the ancient 4 cycle engine theory.
Addition to acting as the damper when sharp changes in acceleration rate, one of the feature of the torsion spring on the friction discs is to reduce the gear backlash rattling noise from the gearbox when in neutral or under acceleration or steady speed cruising.
So, spreading the inertia evenly will help reducing the potential changes in angular speed."
Please more .
P.S.I'm working on my English
I have to agree that this UK website is far superior for DIYs than nsxprime, unbelievable what I've learned here.......
Platinum Member
Very short testdrive (actually only in front of the house): shifting is fine, clutch is fine, no oil leaks.
Two problems:
- in sharp turns the diff was making some rattling noise I was worried about. The more I drove the quieter it got. The diff was taken apart completly and might needed more oil. I've refilled the gearbox with the old oil and will change to new MTF III after a few km to flush out any dust.
- the backlights are permanently ON. I remember that I've pulled and twisted on the rubber cap when removing it which was not a good idea. But that will be a pretty simple repair. Thanks to the good design of the gearbox you can change it with the oil still in.
Platinum Member
The weather forecast was too good to postpone the re-registration. So she's back on the road. On an extended 'installation lap' (well, more km than McLaren-Honda usually does in one test day) she drove fine. With a cold gearbox the differential still rattles in sharp U-turns. But it went away when warmed up. I still have to fill in new MTF III and hoping that it goes away forever. Shifting gears was ok/good. I might have to adjust the cables a little bit. Even with being easy on it the clutch smells a little bit, pretty normal.
All the noises went away: 5th gear marbles, input shaft bearing with clutch pedal up.
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote
